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#81 JCTucker

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Posted 04 July 2011 - 05:02 PM

BioShock?

FPS don't need multiplayer modes, but then they definitely *do* need a much stronger singleplayer component to compensate.

When I wrote that 4 days ago, I was really hoping someone would bring up Bioshock. Bioshock was as much an FPS as Oblivion.

#82 aander91

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Posted 04 July 2011 - 05:44 PM

what
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#83 JCTucker

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Posted 05 July 2011 - 06:13 AM

what

Solid post. You should really post more. We miss this kind of quality.

Edited by JCTucker, 05 July 2011 - 06:24 AM.


#84 txlonghorn

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Posted 05 July 2011 - 07:12 AM

When I wrote that 4 days ago, I was really hoping someone would bring up Bioshock. Bioshock was as much an FPS as Oblivion.


This is confusing, I think by posting "what" he was asking for clarification so that he could then properly reply.

You're so aggressive lately JC

Edited by txlonghorn, 05 July 2011 - 07:13 AM.


#85 JCTucker

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Posted 05 July 2011 - 08:17 AM

This is confusing, I think by posting "what" he was asking for clarification so that he could then properly reply.

You're so aggressive lately JC


What's confusing about it?

Bioshock was a first-person adventure game. Shooting was an aspect of the game. It was maybe 40% FPS, 40% Adventure, 20% RPG. It was also released 4 years ago.

Anyone looking to offer it as a counterpoint to my contention that a FPS in 2011 is expected to have a competitive multiplayer mode might as well put forward Oblivion, also. Its inferior sequel also defeats the argument. They shoehorned in a competitive multiplayer mode 2 years later.

By FPS standards, it was lacking. The enemies just blindly charged you. Combat was more about using your Plasmids within the environment. Set flammables on fire, electrocute enemies standing in water, etc.

#86 Syracuse022

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Posted 05 July 2011 - 09:05 AM

Bioshock was one of my favorite games ever. I also enjoyed the sequel, including the shoehorn-tiplayer (I think I'm close to a level 20). I understand what you're trying to say re: Oblivion and Bioshock being first person adventures, but Bioshock is definitely an FPS by most people's definitions. I also highly doubt Bioshock Infinite will have multiplayer, for the record.

#87 Niterider

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Posted 05 July 2011 - 05:02 PM

I can name two successful FPS's off the top of my head that were made in 2010 with no multiplayer component whatsoever. Metro 2033 and Fallout New Vegas. There are numerous others with trivial multiplayer components that would've done just as well without them.
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#88 JCTucker

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Posted 05 July 2011 - 08:02 PM

Oblivion 3 and a game that is sold (and has been for over a year) for less than $20 on the PC (where 2/3 of its sales are attributed) are your counterpoints? Not to mention the fact that it was developed on the cheap in Ukraine... As Dani stated several times... Neither of these games "is Halo."

#89 Niterider

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Posted 06 July 2011 - 03:40 PM

Oblivion 3 and a game that is sold (and has been for over a year) for less than $20 on the PC (where 2/3 of its sales are attributed) are your counterpoints? Not to mention the fact that it was developed on the cheap in Ukraine...

Yup.
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#90 JCTucker

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Posted 06 July 2011 - 05:54 PM

Yup.


That's cool. I've been wanting to give 2033 a shot. Do you recommend it?

#91 Niterider

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Posted 06 July 2011 - 07:07 PM

Nope. The game's only good as a PC tech demo unless you're a fan of survival shooters.
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#92 JCTucker

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Posted 06 July 2011 - 07:17 PM

Nope. The game's only good as a PC tech demo unless you're a fan of survival shooters.


Not even for $12 or whatever Steam's selling it for now? I wouldn't buy it for 360, obviously.

#93 aander91

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Posted 06 July 2011 - 08:10 PM

Half-Life 2
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#94 JCTucker

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Posted 06 July 2011 - 08:28 PM

Half-Life 2



Ok example, if a bit dated. It also shipped with Team Fortress 2 a couple years later, an exclusively online game.

#95 Slightly Live

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Posted 06 July 2011 - 08:40 PM

Was Portal 2 mentioned?

#96 JCTucker

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Posted 07 July 2011 - 05:27 AM

Was Portal 2 mentioned?


No, but it is not an FPS. It's an FPP.

#97 Jironimo

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Posted 07 July 2011 - 06:27 AM

Ok example, if a bit dated. It also shipped with Team Fortress 2 a couple years later, an exclusively online game.

Halo Anniversary also shipped with Halo Reach, and exclusively online game mode.

#98 JCTucker

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Posted 07 July 2011 - 09:27 AM

Posted Image

#99 Jironimo

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Posted 07 July 2011 - 09:58 AM

lol, I actually love that song JC. It has Krazie Bone in it and I'm an old Bone Thugs ~n~ Harmony fan.

#100 Syracuse022

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Posted 07 July 2011 - 11:45 AM

I don't know JC, you might be the one trolling here. People have come up with a number of well-received, popular examples and you've dismissed them all as not fitting into the FPS genre or not counting for some other tenuous reason.

For my part, Dani bringing up Portal 2 really made me think:
I bought Portal 2 on release day for a full $60 and I don't regret my purchase because of how I perceive Valve as a company. To my mind, they are one of the select few studios that really, truly appreciates their fans, aches to be the best at their craft, and wants to see video games as an artistic medium pushed forward above all else (Thank You Based Gabe). That said, here's what I got in that package - a great campaign experience with incredible writing, character development, etc. (and one hell of a jaw-dropping moment at the end), a co-op campaign that sounded nice in practice but has only been played for maybe 20 minutes (though I hope to change that when my life gets less crazy). There is also some very interesting developer commentary, but that's it --- there's not a whole lot of replay value to be had (until enough time has passed that I've forgotten more of the solutions).

In Anniversary, I would be getting a very similar package (and for less than I was willing to pay for Portal 2), so why do I perceive it so differently? Halo had infinitely more replay value than I've gotten from the Portal series, and it will continue to do so (i.e. I'm not going to stop loving it any time soon). So I tried to really delineate why this remake just "feels" wrong (i.e. why I don't have a Frankie erotica folder).
1) Copy/paste - Halo's art is beautiful, captivating, full of architecture and color palettes that distinguish it from every other game on the market at the time or even now. As such, I can see myself gasping in awe at the chance to see the original assets in true HD (assuming the frame rate has been fixed), but the touch-up job? A lot of the environment art seems compelling enough (dat swamp), but it feels like a slap in the face to see character models get the command-c, command-v job straight from Halo: Reach
2) Eat your broccoli - Portal 2 wasn't viewed as an attempt to catalyze a fanbase back into what Valve deemed to be their most important multiplayer offering (although they do have some tricks up their sleeves). It was, simply and unequivocally, an attempt to give fans of Portal 1 what they wanted (a return to that universe).
3) Outsourced - I work in software. You're kidding yourself if you think that a) the companies being asked to do this have the same level of talent as Microsoft has marshalled for Halo 4 within 343i itself and B) Microsoft/343i considers this any kind of a priority. Big ticket items don't get handed to the outsourced team half a world away (yes, I realize these guys are domestic, but they're not within reach of Voc's fists if they screw something up). This is some Activision-level, off-year Call of Duty "fan service." Halo fans (especially the original ones) deserve better - for a while, we were literally the only consumers keeping Microsoft's foray into gaming afloat.

I see one's development as largely defined by a "We don't need this," or "This will be good enough," attitude. I see the other more along the lines of "No, this could be better, this has to be better - our fans deserve it."



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