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Legendary Map Pack

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#41 Cocopjojo

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Posted 24 February 2008 - 09:39 AM

I'm with Voc on the vehicle. I'm 99% positive it'll be a Warthog with a snow "skin" on it. Later tonight, I'll look for the comments backing that have been made that back this up.

#42 Kinetic

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Posted 24 February 2008 - 09:50 AM

If Sidewinder and Lockout do indeed return, I hope to God they stay in their original locales. I remember Frank saying a little while back that they were working on at least one map that has a Halo in it, so my fears are at least partially subsided.

#43 Va1or

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Posted 24 February 2008 - 10:53 AM

Well, I should say that I think the vehicle change I had in mind would be largely visual, like perhaps a new skin and sound. I don't know if we'll get a pure recreation of the Snowhog, with hatch doors and all. I don't have the data with me, but if I recall, there have been some pretty meaty hints in that category. Could be wrong, but that's what I'm going with. That being said, I would like to see the Prowler used more often and this would be a good chance to use it given the ice-covered landscape.


Yeah, good point. I forgot about the aesthetic changes mentioned in the past.

#44 Va1or

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Posted 24 February 2008 - 01:15 PM

I'm with Voc on the vehicle. I'm 99% positive it'll be a Warthog with a snow "skin" on it. Later tonight, I'll look for the comments backing that have been made that back this up.



I think this is at least one of the quotes you are looking for.

http://www.bungie.ne...y...s&cid=13160

"Crzymnky069 asks: Will any of the new maps in the future have a vehicle specific to it? Kind of like the Elephant on Sandtrap.

There will be vehicle variations, both aesthetic and functional, specific to certain maps in DLC, but we currently don’t have any plans to introduce a brand new vehicle to the Halo 3 sandbox."


Wouldn't a Snow Hog like the one with treads in old screens be a "brand new vehicle?" Frankie says they are making no new vehicles. However, it's possible something like a Snow Hog could just be considered an "aesthetic and functional" variation. It's also possible that they go the lazy route and just give us Hogs and tanks painted white. That would at least be aesthetic changes. That wouldn't be "functional" change though. Snow treads that drove differently would definitely be a functional change. A Different weapon mounted on a Hog, like a rocket would be a functional change.

Judging from Frankie's words there will be some visual and functional changes, but not enough to merit calling it a "new vehicle."

Edit:

The old Hog variations, for reference.

Posted Image

Edited by Va1or, 24 February 2008 - 02:30 PM.


#45 vociferous

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Posted 25 February 2008 - 07:03 AM

When they were previewing vehicles for Halo 3, one of their articles (03/26/2007) said this about the Warthog variants:

A number of variants of the Warthog are in service with UNSC forces, including the M831 TT (which eliminates the support weapon in favor of four side-facing passenger seats), the M864 A (with an enclosed passenger compartment and treads in place of wheels), and the M914 RV (equipped with a towing winch and a heavy duty motor and gear system).

Technically speaking, it's not a 'new vehicle' for two reasons. First, the concept of the Snowhog has been out since 2003, during the development of Halo 2. Secondly, it is a Warthog, as it is discussed in the same entry that is listed above. If Frank had stated that it was a new vehicle, people would be disappointed if they ended up with a Snowhog. Stating that it's an existing vehicle, with aesthetic and functional changes, is a far more measured statement.

I guess the real question is what level of changes would Bungie attempt at a vehicle which will only appear in multiplayer and will only be used during multiplayer matches with downloadable content? The snow-white skin is an obvious change, but it couldn't stop there could it? Technically, it being the color white is 'functional' in the sense of being able to covertly move within snow and ice, just as green and brown are functional on the average Warthog in an earthen environment. But I can't believe for a second that this could be considered functional within Halo 3's combat system.

Snow Treads...

If there is a serious functional change, my guess is going to be, first and foremost, the metal-studded treads instead of tires. As in Halo: Combat Evolved, a vehicle like the Warthog which is already squirrelly in and of itself, is really a sitting duck on ice when you throw in a pair of heavy vehicles and infantry with heavy arms. They're unresponsive, slow and easy targets. Although I think we?ll have the option of having the average M12, but my guess is that by default, we'll be getting at least one Snowhog on each side.

Enclosed Cab...

Now what about the enclosed cab with hatch doors? That?s an entire animation which would have to be created (doors opening and closing), as well as a new collision detection system not currently implemented with the existing M12 model. My real question would be: Is Bungie willing to do that for downloadable content? And if they are, will it provide any distinct advantages in the field or is it just for show?

If there is an enclosed cab, it?ll definitely change the flow of the game. I would imagine that sniping a driver would be especially difficult ? but aside from that, getting the vehicle down would likely require a system of heavy weapons. Tanks, are an obvious inclusion ? but I bet we?ll see a number of missile pods, rocket launchers and possibly even fuel rod guns to balance against such a vehicle.

Weapon...

Although not mentioned in the article, one of the clear objections to this vehicle could be the lack of a LAAG of Gauss weapon. If it lacks a weapon, not only would it make sense for it to have an enclosed cab, but it would practically need one. Still, there definitely does appear to be room on the back. I'd honestly be surprised if a vehicle of this nature didn't have any weapons, but If it doesn't, expect to see M12 units on the map as well.

By giving the player both the M12 and the M864, they could create a very interesting choice for teams. The M12 is faster, has a heavy weapon and handles better in the snow - but has an open cab where drivers are suceptible to low-grade infantry fire -OR- the M864 which, although slower, can cut through ice and various shortcuts with ease, climbs over inclines at an efficient rate, as well as provide ample cover due to its armored cab. This choice would make for interesting combat scenarios if implemented - with each vehicle responding better in certain circumstances. I like the strategy that this concept would bring to the table.

#46 urk

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Posted 25 February 2008 - 07:46 AM

I'm going to swish the idea of a retrofitted Warthog around for a bit. Bear with me.

So, I think a good place to start when thinking about a new vehicle would be the map settings themselves. We can almost rule out Ghost town as there's really nothing there that would require a new vehicle design, not to mention that we've seen the vehicle placement on the map from the overhead that Bungie provided. Of course, that's not definitive by any stretch, but I don't know that there's anything on the map that would work within the fiction to require a different type of vehicle.

"What would?", you might ask yourself. Well, I'll give you a speculative answer. Space.

Moonbase Alpha. Think rover. The UNSC would need an enclosed cockpit, a new drive system (possibly treads, more likely more wheels and suspension), and due to the low atmospheric pressure, they might choose to go with the Gauss Cannon or some other weaponry that would perform better than a standard turret in zero G.

Also, I've been asking for a Moon Patrol redesign since the Halo 2 days and I think Bungie had finally listened to my plea.

That said, it'll probably be a hovercraft.

#47 Va1or

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Posted 25 February 2008 - 08:08 AM

It's also a very real possibility that we get a playable Troop Hog that allows players to hop in the back. Storming the opposing base with 6 Spartans in one vehicle would be pretty sick, I'd wager. I think that would qualify as "surprising." I bet Bungie originally intended for it's use in MP but ran out of time. I mean, even in campaign you can't have your 3 co-op buddies in one Troop Hog. That had to have been a time issue.

#48 mattacus

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Posted 25 February 2008 - 01:22 PM

The time of the Gold Banshee is upon us.

#49 Drew

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Posted 25 February 2008 - 03:58 PM

It's also a very real possibility that we get a playable Troop Hog that allows players to hop in the back. Storming the opposing base with 6 Spartans in one vehicle would be pretty sick, I'd wager. I think that would qualify as "surprising." I bet Bungie originally intended for it's use in MP but ran out of time. I mean, even in campaign you can't have your 3 co-op buddies in one Troop Hog. That had to have been a time issue.

An even bigger case for this argument, I think, is that the Troop Hogs on The Pit are actually drivable in multiplayer. It's already there, and with a few small modifications, it wouldn't be all that hard to have it work with more than two players, either. Seems like the most reasonable guess to me.

#50 Self Induced

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Posted 25 February 2008 - 04:03 PM

It's also a very real possibility that we get a playable Troop Hog that allows players to hop in the back. Storming the opposing base with 6 Spartans in one vehicle would be pretty sick, I'd wager. I think that would qualify as "surprising." I bet Bungie originally intended for it's use in MP but ran out of time. I mean, even in campaign you can't have your 3 co-op buddies in one Troop Hog. That had to have been a time issue.

I can already hear the announcer...

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#51 vociferous

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Posted 25 February 2008 - 04:12 PM

The time of the Gold Banshee is upon us.

For some reason I never even thought of this. I can't see this map without at least one Banshee. Were Banshees on Halo PC's version of Sidewinder?

My only question about the Troop Transport, although I'd love to see it, is how they would work the firing/riding scenario. I don't know how four Spartans would work in the back of one of them.

#52 PRO_KING

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Posted 25 February 2008 - 04:23 PM

couldn't the troop hog in campaign hold 5 marines in the back? 2 on each side of the bench and 1 on the back edge?

#53 Drew

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Posted 25 February 2008 - 04:32 PM

For some reason I never even thought of this. I can't see this map without at least one Banshee. Were Banshees on Halo PC's version of Sidewinder?

My only question about the Troop Transport, although I'd love to see it, is how they would work the firing/riding scenario. I don't know how four Spartans would work in the back of one of them.

For the Banshee question, yes, they had a Banshee in the PC version of Sidewinder. It was pretty cool.

As for the Troop Hog one, who knows? Maybe you'll sacrifice firepower for mobility? It'd be unorthodox, but I don't see why not.

#54 Drew

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Posted 27 February 2008 - 01:22 PM

Posted Image

#55 Cocopjojo

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Posted 27 February 2008 - 03:04 PM

This map looks seriously awesome.

#56 Syracuse022

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Posted 27 February 2008 - 04:01 PM

It looks like a Call of Duty map to me...

#57 Drew

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Posted 27 February 2008 - 04:06 PM

It looks like a Call of Duty map to me...

It really does. Very visually busy. I must say, I like it a lot.

#58 Syracuse022

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Posted 27 February 2008 - 04:08 PM

Posted Image

#59 Blaze

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Posted 27 February 2008 - 04:31 PM

It looks like a Call of Duty map to me...

Clearly an attempt to pull CoD4 players back to Halo 3.

#60 Cocopjojo

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Posted 27 February 2008 - 04:35 PM

It looks like a mix between Turf, Terminal, Sanctuary and Warlock.



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